Elf Warden

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Sunrise Samurai
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Elf Warden

Post by Sunrise Samurai » Mon Feb 26, 2018 12:51 pm

Elf Warden
Cost 8
Hp 50
Armor 2/2
Power 16
Range 1
Speed 6
Dodge counter 50%
Spell resistance 50%
Spells: lembas healing
Bonuses: strong against cavalry
Last edited by Sunrise Samurai on Tue Feb 27, 2018 8:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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makazuwr32
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by makazuwr32 » Mon Feb 26, 2018 1:32 pm

1 question - "the same bonuses" means also that they'll have bonuses against buildings and mega buildings?

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Sunrise Samurai
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by Sunrise Samurai » Mon Feb 26, 2018 3:01 pm

Errrr....... forgot they had that. No, I don't think a cavalry unit with a bonus against buildings is a good idea, unless it's a dedicated anti building unit. I was more thinking good against cavalry and giants.
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godOfKings
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by godOfKings » Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:15 pm

Warden basically means guard of prisons, in Warcraft 3 there was an elf warden hero who looked after the prison that held illidian, and when illidian escaped from jail, the warden hero basically searched the whole world to find her prisoner, does keeping the meaning of warden accurate in the entire story, I don't think an elf warden is a good name for cavalry unit
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godOfKings
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by godOfKings » Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:28 pm

Here's a suggestion (however I didn't install aof so don't have much idea about names)
Elvish Giantslayer
High Sentinel
Sentinel Champion
Nature Protector

EDIT: these might b better names
Elf Punisher
Punisher of corruption
Chaos Warden (like imprisons chaos and other evil stuff)
There is no place for false kings here, only those who proves themselves to b the true kings of legend, or serves under me

For I watch over this world looking for those worthy to become kings, and on the way get rid of the fakes and rule over the fools

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makazuwr32
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by makazuwr32 » Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:53 pm

Sunrise Samurai wrote:Errrr....... forgot they had that. No, I don't think a cavalry unit with a bonus against buildings is a good idea, unless it's a dedicated anti building unit. I was more thinking good against cavalry and giants.
They have bonuses against 95-99% of units and buildings in the game.
Giants, cavalry, Infantries, Troll headhunters (i don't think that they are "giants"), archers...
godOfKings wrote:Here's a suggestion (however I didn't install aof so don't have much idea about names)
Elvish Giantslayer
High Sentinel
Sentinel Champion
Nature Protector

EDIT: these might b better names
Elf Punisher
Punisher of corruption
Chaos Warden (like imprisons chaos and other evil stuff)
Maybe...
Demon Hunter
Elven Champion

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Sunrise Samurai
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by Sunrise Samurai » Mon Feb 26, 2018 5:32 pm

dictionary.com wrote:Warden
1. A person charged with the care or custody of persons, animals, or things; keeper.
More synonymous with fish and game warden than prison warden. I think it still fits.
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General Brave
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by General Brave » Mon Feb 26, 2018 5:56 pm

High Sentinel.
Wise, Might, Loyalty. Forever stands Warfell.

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Alexander82
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by Alexander82 » Mon Feb 26, 2018 11:30 pm

Those bonuses aren't fit a mounted unit. Sentinels are good against cavalry and I don't feel the need for a unit strong versus everything and with no weakness.

If you want an elite cavalry unit should have a bonus that cavalry has (mostly anti-infantry and sometimes anti-cavalry if they wield spears).

The strength of cavalry is basically its movement (in that case should be 6 since foot elves move by 4).
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makazuwr32
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by makazuwr32 » Tue Feb 27, 2018 5:44 am

I'm thinking about great bonuses to giants and normal to cavalry and infantries. And they would be vurable to pikemen and other anti cavalry units.

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Alexander82
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by Alexander82 » Tue Feb 27, 2018 10:26 am

We can apply the same bonus as sentinels. Sentinels already have a great bonus coupled with the dodge chance.

Generally counter units are very vulnerable to everything else (see the pikeman) but in the case of sentinels they are pretty sturdy and still strong against almost everything.

Keeping the same concept (an elite unit with few downsides that this time would only be anti cavalry) we can't give a huge bonus (also because its basic stats are already good).
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makazuwr32
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by makazuwr32 » Tue Feb 27, 2018 10:41 am

If excluding bonuses to buildings (as they i think must be removed still) current sentinel has 50% bonus to cavalries and 100% bonus to giants. I think same bonuses can be applied to mounted version but instead of 50% to cavalries 50% bonus to infantry units and maybe 25% to cavalry.

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Alexander82
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by Alexander82 » Tue Feb 27, 2018 1:07 pm

It depends.

If you want it a spear wielder (as the sentinel) I think we can go for bonus to cavalry but no bonus to infantry (or just sword and shield and no bonus to cavalry)

The idea of the sentinel was that of a heavy armored foot soldier with a tower shield (used on foot only) able to defend against giants to create a mobile walls for archers

About stats I'd go for those:
Cost: 8
HP: 60
Attack: 20 (sword)
Range: 1
Armor: 2 (smaller shield)
P.Armor: 2 (smaller shield)
Speed: 6
Sight: 5
Dodge Counter: 50%
Spell Resistance: 40%
Action: 1
Bonus: 25% against infantry, 50% against giants
Special actions: none
This way is a more mobile damage dealer with more HP that can easily dispose of infantry units and can still deal a lot of damage to giants

I raised its attack to 20 (23 with techs and 24 with ent warrior aura) and it will be able to deal a lot of damage to any kind of unit. To keep the damage more or less on par with the sentinel (that is more a counter unit) i lowered the bonuses
I lowered the armor by 50% cause it will have a smaller shield but raised its hp by 50%
I removed the strengthen since it was meant to act for the sentinel as a defensive maneuver (Someone might recall that it should have lowered speed for that turn) but it will be compensated by both higher hp (higher healing with lembas wich is a % heal) and increased attack (+4 instead of +3)
Movement is what will make it a great unit on the battlefield (with high movement and damage you can easily hit where you need to).

For flavor i'd make it ride a unicorn.
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makazuwr32
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by makazuwr32 » Tue Feb 27, 2018 1:19 pm

Good stats, but increase by 1 at least his sight range.
Other than that i totally agree with.

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Sunrise Samurai
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by Sunrise Samurai » Tue Feb 27, 2018 3:03 pm

Honestly I was looking for an elite lancer. Something to counter elite cavalry on their terms with similar speed, stats, and a bonus against them without a weakness to them. In exchange, it doesn't have a bonus against infantry like a normal mounted unit. Compare to AoS lancer. I only included giants because I was basing it off sentinel.

Elves are currently pretty weak to elite cavalry that can shrug off arrows and race circles around sentinels until a chance comes to one shot them. An elite lance cavalry would be a strong answer to them, but reasonably removed for the cost by any decent anti cavalry unit.

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godOfKings
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by godOfKings » Tue Feb 27, 2018 3:30 pm

Well the name isn't actually similar to the sentinel in any way, so it doesn't necessarily have to b based on the sentinel, it can b a completely separate and new unit by itself
There is no place for false kings here, only those who proves themselves to b the true kings of legend, or serves under me

For I watch over this world looking for those worthy to become kings, and on the way get rid of the fakes and rule over the fools

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Alexander82
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by Alexander82 » Tue Feb 27, 2018 5:07 pm

If you are looking for a strong lancer it is a different kind of unit. Less armored and with no bonus against giants.
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Sunrise Samurai
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by Sunrise Samurai » Tue Feb 27, 2018 8:40 pm

How's it look now? Any suggestion on stats and cost? Might not actually need 8 cost.
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Alexander82
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Re: Elf Warden

Post by Alexander82 » Tue Feb 27, 2018 11:03 pm

I need to check all cavalry units and make some maths but the concept might be ok.
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