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Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:45 am
by makazuwr32
If you want some sort of unit in which archers can get a cover and attack from inside than suggest siege mantlet for humans.

Like the one scaledfolks have.

But not a FAST TRANSPORT UNIT WITH HIGH HP.

I read stats. Updated ones.
Again NO.

1. Too high stats. All. Even though lowered speed still too high.
2. Chariots have carry capacity 1.
3. Still stats look like ent warrior with a bit lesser speed but needs no researches and has higher speed and carry capacity.

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:47 am
by Savra
Then we go back to chariot idea.

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:48 am
by Tankhead
Aww upgraded wagons didn't seem like a bad idea

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:50 am
by makazuwr32
1 question:
Did you think that if units can attack from inside than they can mend as well from inside? And if put inside one worker it can become nearly unkillable if you won't kill this unit in single turn.

I personally think that upgraded wagons for humans will be great thing. Not too op (because they will be trainable only in tc and can't be constructed by workers at all so you can't spam them) but definately will make humans much better in battle logistics (also remember that dwarves will get their zeppelin carriers disabled from construction at all).

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:53 am
by Savra
Don't worry those could be in a separate topic. The original idea for chariot was to take the place of a giant and the such. I sense elves might get a ent sentinel or something, dwarves have mythril golem, orcs have Olog hai, scaledfolks have the chieftain, undead have Juggernaut.

This would be humans replacement as a powerful chariot.

No on heal inside, wagons don't have that.
It would only be buildable through castle and siege workshop.

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:58 am
by makazuwr32
1. If this is chariot than it will be cavalry. Vurable to pikes.
2. Chariots don't have much carry capacity. Max is 2.
3. Wagons don't have ability to attack from inside. Siege mantlets have.
4. As for giants to humans they can have some from elementals. Like Stone golem (hp around 80) and Stone titan (bigger variant, hp up to 160) as example.

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:02 am
by Savra
So basically, imperial stone titan? Trainable at castle and mage hut?

Btw, I made it originally a chariot for the purpose that it had a weakness that everyone can take care of.

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:04 am
by makazuwr32
Wait. No imperial thing.
Stone tital is a stone titan.

As for chariot it always will be cavalry unit that can't move through forests.

Elephants will be also thing one day. They also in your ligic must have imperial variant. As well as blue dragons, drake knights and warmages. Right? Because why not? Imperial drake knight sounds soo good! And imperial blue dragon sound even better! Because this magic "imperial" word can remove all its weaknesses!

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:05 am
by Savra
Ya, just started thinking it was too long of a name.
But roughly same concept correct?

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:10 am
by makazuwr32
About stone golem and stone titan:
Both will be elemental units, giants.
Trainable at mage hut and arcane sanctum (no for castle).
They will be some sort of ents without carry capacity but with higher speed (3 speed).

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:13 am
by Savra
Ok. So we stick with chariot here for imperials. So typical chariot stats, fear aura 2, and melee damage. Might lower spd by 1 from the imperial knight.

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:21 am
by makazuwr32
I think if you want some sort of chariot that it should be like this:
(No auras!)
Cost - 5 turns, trainable at stables (also in castle if as imperial unit)
Hp - 40
Attack - 16
Range - 1
Armor - 3/3
Speed - 4, can't move through forest
Sight - 6
Carry capacity - 1 (can carry only foot units like swordman, archer, can't carry siege, wagons and cavalry, units inside can act like in tower), can't be carried by wagons.
Spell resist - 100%
50% bonus to infantries, archers, giants.

It will be intresting unit that can perform melee attack and can carry one unit (archer/mage/infantry) which can act as in tower. Not op but tactically will become really useful and intresting (especially as movable cover for human mages).

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:26 am
by Tankhead
Just wanna add they can't move in forest terrain

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:30 am
by Savra
That's what it says. I thought chariots had fear aura that's why I said it.

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:31 am
by makazuwr32
In aos they have no aura. In aof they don't even exist yet.

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:09 pm
by Gral.Sturnn
Mak the wagon cant move and shoot a t the same time it eill have a deployement action in wich it will stay immovile consuming both actions

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:12 pm
by Gral.Sturnn
If you want to move again you will need to redeploy consuming both actions and in the next turn you will move

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 2:05 pm
by Midonik
Yeah, code me possiblity of consuming speed with transformation and getting it back in next turn and we are done... Well I might be mistaken and if can be done with JSONs, but I don't think so.
Anyway, I still like the mak's idea more.

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:52 pm
by General Brave
I would support it.
If it has.
2 Capacity.
3 Speed.
And allowed Units to attack from it.
As long as this has reasonable Cost, health, and armor.
This would be in between a regular wagon and a ram.

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:05 pm
by Savra
Alright what are we going with here?

Chariot or wagon?

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:09 pm
by makazuwr32
I don't support wagon idea. Not only because of damage (that is not the main complain about that idea).

Chariot with 1 carry capacity will be better.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:21 am
Imperial chariot
Cost - 5 turns, trainable at stables (also in castle if as imperial unit)
Hp - 40
Attack - 16
Range - 1
Armor - 3/3
Speed - 4, can't move through forest
Sight - 6
Carry capacity - 1 (can carry only foot units like swordman, mage, healer, archer, can't carry siege, wagons and cavalry, units inside can act like in tower - attack, use spells), can't be carried by wagons.
Spell resist - 100%
50% bonus to infantries, archers, giants.
Just think:
You can with this unit make pretty powerful combination if you will put inside healer of mage - healer can support your units without fear to be one shotted and mage as even more costly unit is even better because you need him to get closer to enemies for using some his spells (slowing, disarmor) and this way he will be able to live longer.

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:17 pm
by StormSaint373
Make up your minds, units don't get implemented with constant bickering over 1 choice or another.

If it's that big of a deal, make a new topic titled "Imperial Battle Chariot". This is a wagon topic, and the argument slows progress and takes people off topic!

Continue in unison, or not at all.

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:41 pm
by Midonik
The point is that it was meant as sort of battel chariot and then get changed to wagon...

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:57 pm
by StormSaint373
If it is impossible to make a hybrid to accommodate, then a choice will need to be made or the Topic be archived!

It gets dis heartening for gamers to look on a forum and see petty arguing over something Soo simple as a unit suggestion.

1. Choose either Wagon or Chariot
2. Base stats off of that and build up instead of tearing others ideas down!
3. Notify dev and implement after worked up.

Personally, I like the idea of a Chariot augmenting the Wagon, maybe even being an upgrade.

As for it replacing Giants, NO!

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:00 pm
by Tankhead
Just remember what ever humans get Buildable related
Dwarfs will need something better

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:09 pm
by Savra
Not a chariot for dwarves, I say we stick with chariot. I liked that concept originally and the idea for it helping human spell casters. Is even better.

Imperials won't need a giant for their group if this is the case but I think health might be good little low for a chariot? Chariots only lacked mobility when it came to average cavalry and maybe we could increase cost.

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:09 pm
by StormSaint373
Like Chariot Idea.

StormSaint suggestion

Cost: 5
Hp: 54
Att: 14
Range: 1
Armor: 3 (Affected by cav upgrades)
Pierce: 3 (Affected by cav upgrades)
Speed: 4 (cannot travel through forests)
Vision: 6
Action/Turn: 1
Carry Capacity: 1 Able to act within confines of chariot, priests can heal, mages can buff, Archers can shoot, etc.
Spell Resistance: 50% (100% if imperial)

Bonuses: 100% vs All infantry, (has no means of fighting Giants) just doesn't make sense.

Re: Imperial battle wagon

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:12 pm
by Tankhead
Im not saying chariot for dwarfs
Im saying they will need something better

Re: Imperial War Chariot

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:23 pm
by StormSaint373
If anything, maybe an armored Dwarven battle ram. Carry 4 units instead of 3 with more health, and units can act while inside. More on that later... Dwarves should have something Sturdier. I agree Tankhead.

Re: Imperial War Chariot

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:29 pm
by Tankhead
StormSaint373 wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:23 pm
If anything, maybe an armored Dwarven battle ram. Carry 4 units instead of 3 with more health, and units can act while inside. More on that later... Dwarves should have something Sturdier. I agree Tankhead.
Should I make a topic on that?
Sounds good