Page 1 of 1

Elephant Balista

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 9:53 am
by Joddy El Campeador
Balista loaded to the elephant back
Stats like balista and HP&speed like the elephant

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 9:58 am
by makazuwr32
uhm. just no.
also please no multipost.

Remember we don't need fantastic units. for that you can go to AoF.
Here we need historical units only.

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 12:46 pm
by samuelch
Khmer used ballista on elephants.
"In the Southeast Asia, the powerful Khmer Empire had come to regional dominance by the 9th century AD, drawing heavily on the use of war elephants. Uniquely, the Khmer military deployed double cross-bows on the top of their elephants."

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 1:39 pm
by makazuwr32
I will look for more scources if this is real one.
Thanks for idea of period.

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 4:15 pm
by godOfKings
Could b an upgrade of elephant archer?

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 7:18 pm
by makazuwr32
I looked for my scources and i must say that it was their never realised concept.
And even more why it is not historically accurate because ballista was designed in Late Rome time (4th century) when Khmers empire was dead i think for at least a 5 centuries.

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:34 am
by samuelch
It's not a balista. It's just similar to balista. Civilization games have Khmer with Elephant balista as unique units.

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 4:42 am
by makazuwr32
Then it must have due to flaws only one action/turn.
And better name.
I agree about upgrade of elephant archer.

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:39 am
by godOfKings
Here is my idea, it is upgrade of elephant Archer, it has 2 actions since its 'repeating crossbow', 6 atk, no area damage, 5 range, HP and armour shall b same as basic elephant Archer

Upgrade cost is 6 turns
For six turns u get 1+ atk 1+ action, no extra spell resist, speed or hp

Wat will b name? Khmer elephant crossbowman ? Or Khmer elephant ballista? Or simply elephant ballista or elephant crossbowman?

Description: The Khmer empire used a unique strategy combining war elephants with repeating crossbows to destroy their enemies from above

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:44 am
by godOfKings
altalt throwers, auxiliary skirmishers and voulgirs should get high bonus against elephant archers, and voulgirs should also get high bonus against elephants in general

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 12:39 pm
by makazuwr32
Gok Variant is fine.

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:13 am
by godOfKings
in case stratego decides this to b upgrade of elephant archer, here is final stat suggestion.

Khmer elephant ballista
(upgrades from elephant archer)

Description: The Khmer empire used a unique strategy combining war elephants with repeating crossbows to destroy their enemies from above

cost of upgrade tech: 6 turns
hp: 120
atk: 6
armor: 1
p.armor:2
speed: 2
range: 5
action: 2
spell resist: 0
gets basic blacksmith upgrades same as elephant archer
summary:
godOfKings wrote:
Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:39 am
Here is my idea, it is upgrade of elephant Archer, it has 2 actions since its 'repeating crossbow', 6 atk, no area damage, 5 range, HP and armour shall b same as basic elephant Archer

Upgrade cost is 6 turns
For six turns u get 1+ atk 1+ action, no extra spell resist, speed or hp

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:41 am
by Stratego (dev)
current heavy elephant image

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:20 pm
by godOfKings
Updated previous post with latest image

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 7:14 am
by Morningwarrior
This is very crazy,but is be a good and op unit.

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 7:17 am
by Morningwarrior
Ok,ok I really thought it was literally an elephant-borne ballista not a crossbow guy

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Sun Nov 03, 2019 5:07 pm
by godOfKings
Could b a 7 turn stand alone ballista unit with lower damage and range than ballista

HP 120
Armor 1/1
Range 5
Atk 8
Action 2
Power range 1
Power penalty 50%
Pierce damage
Speed 2
Made in siege workshop not archery range
Can b upgraded by heavy ballista tech to have

130 HP
Armor 2/2
Range 5
Atk 10

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Sun Nov 03, 2019 7:37 pm
by Endru1241
Unfortunately Elephant Ballista is a problem in few ways.

Classification:
If it would be treated as siege engine, then it makes it burnable, which doesn't make sense.
If it would be classified close to Elephant Archer then it would have too little weaknesses.

Building training it:
Archery range training unit with splash damage maybe too much.
Siege workshop training alive unit that depends on hp doesn't fit.

Historical correctness:
There is no evidence, that anywhere in the entire world anyone used ballista on elephants.
Khmer empire mounted chinese-like double bed crossbows, but it could be only for transport.
Even if it was used from the back of elephant - it would require sizing down the weapon - thus more similar to crossbow on steroids than real ballista.
Nonetheless it should be named Elephant Siege Crossbow or something like that.

Pure balance:
Even with only 8 power it deals 16 damage on hit and 8 to every adjacent unit on range!
As it completely outclasses elephant archer it should also cost significantly more - 8-9 turns.

Lastly - it would definitely need it's own upgrade - why would ballista upgrade increase hp of leaving mounted unit?

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Mon Nov 04, 2019 4:18 am
by godOfKings
godOfKings wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:13 am
Khmer elephant ballista

Description: The Khmer empire used a unique strategy combining war elephants with repeating crossbows to destroy their enemies from above

cost: 7 turns
hp: 120
atk: 6
armor: 1
p.armor:2
speed: 2
range: 5
action: 2
spell resist: 0
gets basic blacksmith upgrades same as elephant archer
that was simply a suggestion in case players wants to go the ballista route, and the stats can b changed to better balance it with game, and i already gave a crossbow suggestion above too in case the final decision is go with crossbow (plus crossbow version has ready image so can b implemented right now)

made some changes, not an upgrade and cost 7 turns

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Mon Nov 04, 2019 8:54 pm
by Lynx Shafir
TBH I Don't quite like this idea
Aside from the points mentioned above, don't we have enough elephant already?
I know it's typical and all but, hey...

I would support though any foot Indian units what had quite unique weapons too, wide era range to chose. Before more elepans...

Also WB GOK :)

Re: Elephant Balista

Posted: Tue Nov 05, 2019 10:04 am
by godOfKings
Its your choice, the game only progresses by the majority vote after all, its not a necessity