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Combat reflexes - ANSWERED

Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 1:08 am
by Sunrise Samurai
Requires dodge melee level 3
Research cost 6
All elves get first strike

Since most elves are low hp, this basically gives them a free counterattack before dying. It also slightly reduces the randomness of dodge by ensuring counterattack damage, rather than having it be a surprise when an attack misses. Would be a notable deterrent to attacking sentinels, being the only elf with a significant attack, but not much more than a normal counterattack already is.

Re: Combat reflexes

Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 1:17 am
by General Brave
Doesn't that seems a bit too much?

Re: Combat reflexes

Posted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 2:17 am
by Sunrise Samurai
Not really, considering first strike is actually a very situational thing. It only comes into play when 1. The attacker would die to counterattack damage before hitting (not likely since most elves deal relatively low damage per hit) or 2. The defender would die before dealing counterattack damage (more likely for elves) or 3. When attacking another unit with first strike in a situation where 1 or 2 would apply (actually notable in spearman vs knights once knighthood is added)

The net result would only be a very small damage per unit increase, with some small tactical benefit and a great deal of flavor added.

Re: Combat reflexes

Posted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 11:10 am
by Alexander82
I really think it is too much (especially against humans or undeads)

Re: Combat reflexes

Posted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 1:18 pm
by Ayush Tiwari
Already elf have got so much weaponsmithing and all,
But another way can be if we have this only to their meelee unit and ranged ones,since elves need more on their close battle.

Re: Combat reflexes

Posted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 1:30 pm
by Sunrise Samurai
Actually one concern is that dodge is useless if the enemy has a bonus against your unit. Sentinels are pretty useless against imperial knights and death knights, since they die to them in one hit, and don't fare well when attacking due to counterattacks.

If imperial/heavy knights get first strike from knighthood, were going to need either this or a form of reach to fix the balance to keep elf spearmen type units as worth building.

Re: Combat reflexes

Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 8:33 am
by makazuwr32
I think that this tech woild be good for elves.

Re: Combat reflexes

Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 2:57 pm
by Alexander82
First strike is mostly something thatis given to cavalry (that is one of the reasons why i'm not 100% with that idea)

Anyway what about first strike for elven infantry only?
I would also increase its cost since it might be considered the fourth tier for dodge melee (that is an infantry-only tech)

My only fear is that it would only make the sentinel too strong (it has basically a bonus against everything and would deal a lot of damage to most of the units that would be able to kill it)

Re: Combat reflexes

Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 3:47 pm
by makazuwr32
If first strike only to elven infantry (without any first strike to all other units) then i'm only for it.
I think that 6-8 max cost must be because it needs all 3 dodge melee techs (18 turns for that + at least 6 turns for this one = 24 turns and TC can't produce anything more useful for current situation.)

Re: Combat reflexes

Posted: Tue May 28, 2019 3:42 pm
by Alexander82
Since there is dodge counter I feel that isn't necessary

Re: Combat reflexes

Posted: Tue May 28, 2019 3:42 pm
by Alexander82
Answered