unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Stratego (dev) » Tue Jun 02, 2015 2:58 am

Alexander82 wrote:I'd make humans without vanishing (they have dragons because they train them)
For elves i'd make dragons like a nature ally that work alongside them
humans: ok! it is up on server in 10 minutes!
elves: what do u mean?

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Alexander82
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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Alexander82 » Tue Jun 02, 2015 8:02 am

i mean that they can't control it, like the orcs
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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Ness » Tue Jun 02, 2015 11:22 am

Orc dragon can be controlled if you use way points

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Alexander82
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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Alexander82 » Thu Jun 04, 2015 8:03 pm

that seems a nice idea too
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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Ness » Fri Jun 05, 2015 11:58 am

It wasnt idea it is truth if you use waypoint for orc dragon it flies to waypoint and you can attack with it.

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Alexander82
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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Alexander82 » Sat Jun 06, 2015 11:16 pm

then you should disable that button on the dragon (also you have to disable the multiselect option)
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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Sunrise Samurai » Tue Jun 23, 2015 10:50 pm

I'm not sure the current setup for dragons is entirely that impressive. The elf dragon, for example, is not much more effective than eagles or even human ornithoptors, yet has a devastating vanishing 5 that means it will never amount to a severe threat, as only one is allowed per great tree, which could instead create eagles for the same purpose in eventually greater numbers. Vanishing counters should apply to extremely powerful units or to cheap swarm units like wolves, and that dragon is neither. The very idea of an incontrollable unit seems like sending a one time suicide unit destined for death, and in the end the only dragon that seems truly useful is the undead one. Honestly I consider it a better idea to give dragons elephant level hp, some 20-30 attack power, and either flight or a breath attack with a massive building time to justify a unit that is a credible threat by itself on the battlefield.
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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Stratego (dev) » Fri Jun 26, 2015 1:27 am

imressiveness: they are only the "first" basic dragons, there will be more powerful ones later.
elf dragons: you are right, i made it not vanishing, and a little more costy, and slightly more power.
"The very idea of an incontrollable unit" : yes, orcs can not control any dragon, but they can summon them in vast numbers by sacrificing cheap units
dont forget a dragon that is flying needs no (and must not) have extra big hp, since only flying units can deal big damage on them, so flying is a big advantage.
------------------
lets see with this elf modification - how is it?

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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Ness » Fri Jun 26, 2015 12:09 pm

But human dragon doesnt fly

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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Sunrise Samurai » Fri Jun 26, 2015 12:29 pm

Ok. The elf dragon is much better without vanishing. now the choice is between cheaper eagles with less life and power or more expensive dragons with more life and power for elves, which leaves merit to both choices. I see your point that high health flying units may be an issue, particularly when orcs and undead lack any true ranged capabilities as of the moment. I suppose the quantity of dragons orcs can get by farming out a hamletback or three with troll shamans to keep them healed does make a good case for a debuff like being uncontrollable. I also didn't realize you had plans for more dragons in the future than just the one per race, though it isn't a surprise since the game is still in development.
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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Ness » Fri Jun 26, 2015 5:04 pm

Banshee with undeaeds can be used kill dragon.

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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Stratego (dev) » Sun Jun 28, 2015 6:43 pm

"freet_stay.gif" added to the post where there are many dragon images.

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Alexander82
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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Alexander82 » Tue Nov 10, 2015 5:07 pm

Considering that they have no other flying units and they might become useful to fight enemy dragons can we remove vanishing from orc dragons? After all you need to use 4 units to make one, and receiving the sacrifice should make the dragon motivated enough...
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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Alexander82 » Sun Nov 15, 2015 9:59 am

I also think that undead dragon shouldn't have vanishing, it is already difficult to make a single one
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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Stratego (dev) » Sun Nov 15, 2015 10:01 am

you mean orc dragons?

i have increased the vanishing time by 1. (can not be without wanishing no dragon would work for the orcs as a "servant" these are only temporary "partnership" betw. orcs and dragons if dragon have the same goals as orcs, otherwise no orc could command them)

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Alexander82
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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Alexander82 » Sun Nov 15, 2015 10:05 am

Both dragons for undead and orcs.

Both are difficult to summon and the orc dragon also requires a sacrifice that is important in a army (3 units + a more costly caster). It is also difficult to summon on the battlefield (for space reason, and you also need a free slot to summon). I think we might try leaving it as it is just removing vanishing.

Also for undead dragons, they can make it only if their enemy makes dragon too and if they manage to kill them.
I know that undead can deal with dragons using sacrifice killer (at least is what i do) but seeing how difficult is to summon a dragon they should deinitely be able to keep it alive (after all undeads has no expiration date xD)
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Alexander82
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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Alexander82 » Sun Nov 15, 2015 10:07 am

Daniel (the dev) wrote:you mean orc dragons?

i have increased the vanishing time by 1. (can not be without wanishing no dragon would work for the orcs as a "servant" these are only temporary "partnership" betw. orcs and dragons if dragon have the same goals as orcs, otherwise no orc could command them)
The dragon wouldn't be a servant (you can't control it) but the dragon should help you until the end of the battle if you sacrifice someone for help, also if he wants the death of your enemies he still want tu kill tham after some turns
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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Stratego (dev) » Sun Nov 15, 2015 10:10 am

Also for undead dragons, they can make it only if their enemy makes dragon too and if they manage to kill them.
I know that undead can deal with dragons using sacrifice killer (at least is what i do) but seeing how difficult is to summon a dragon they should deinitely be able to keep it alive (after all undeads has no expiration date xD)
i dont see vanishing on undead dragon tough.

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Alexander82
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Re: unit: dragon IMPLEMENTED

Post by Alexander82 » Sun Nov 15, 2015 10:15 am

Ok, so it was just orc dragon, i wasn't remembering well.

Then even more he shouldn't be the only one with vanishing.

You don't control the dragon, you pay a sacrifice to help you with a battle, so, if the dragon want to help you it mean that he'll help until the end of that battle
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